INTUIT INC. — Call Transcript 2025

Hey, as everyone streams in here, welcome to our next session. Really happy to have you on here with us, Mark. Maybe just talk a little bit about yourself and your role at Intuit, and then we can take it from there. Sure, sure. Yeah, hi, I'm Mark Notarainni. I have the pleasure of leading our consumer team within TurboTax or within Intuit, and that really encompasses TurboTax, Credit Karma, and our ProTax group, so really serving consumers' financial needs. I've been with Intuit now for 18 years in this role for coming up on three now, super excited to be here and really looking forward to talk about the future of our consumer platform. And it's kind of funny because, like, you can't go to these tech conferences and don't start on AI, you know, to talk about AI for any reason. Oh, yeah. Yeah, that's kind of a big deal. Yeah. Weirdly enough, I don't know why. Can you talk a little bit about the thinking from the Intuit management team, how that has evolved in terms of, like, what AI means for you guys? Yeah, AI is an incredible opportunity for us across all of Intuit, both our business platform and our consumer platform, and it really enables us to do done-for-you experiences for customers, right, so we've been in the case of TurboTax an incredible platform that's been driven by a linear interview process, and what AI has enabled us to do is ingest data, apply data, and personalize an experience that basically enables us to do much more of a done-for-you experience, bringing your data, get the work done for you without having to put in information, and then get you the best outcome so that you could finish and file. In the case of TurboTax, in Credit Karma, it enables us to be much more helpful to a customer because of the data points that we have. We have about 70,000 data points on each consumer, and that enables us to actually personalize experiences, beyond credit cards into personal loans, into debt and debt management. And so really, truly becoming a daily interactive product for our consumers and solving real problems every single day. That's all enabled by AI. Yeah. And then can you talk a little bit about the evolution or, like, the action you guys have taken to be ready for that? And there I'm thinking, like, there's, like, a harmonization of the technology. Mm-hmm. There's a data platform, etc. Like, you know, what you know, it sounds all very simple. It's like. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And then, reality is often kind of a bit tougher to. Yeah. It is much harder. Yeah. So, you know, there's the first thing is making sure that we have the data organized, right? And that's a big part of our platform is our data and what we call our data services. So we have the ability to aggregate and collect data that's very important for driving your personal finances. So that's really a transformation that we had to drive. Our data was locked up in different products. And we had to organize it in a way where it could be consumed real-time by a product, and so that's been a big transformation. We also, in the case of TurboTax, right, we're a 40-year-old company, and so we had to modernize our platform across our tax product. We had to do that in QuickBooks as well 'cause it's been around. And one of the things that is very unique, and I think this is important for anybody going through an AI transformation, is you have to have the culture for change, so Intuit has been around for 40 years. Amazing. 40-plus years. We started off as a DOS company. It turns out that the technology they use for DOS doesn't work in the world of AI, and we've been able to migrate and manage through really big technology shifts. This one is super fast and more impactful than the internet or mobile for sure that preceded it, so it really, like, Intuit is a culture of change, and we just really leaned into it and adopted it and understood what it could do to solve customer problems. Yeah. AI could do. Yeah. If you think about that, at least, like, I don't know if you had it, but, like, when ChatGPT came out, there was this horror scenarios 'cause ChatGPT can do your taxes, you know, and then everyone's like, "Okay, well, I don't need TurboTax anymore," etc. Yeah. How, like, talk a little bit about the journey that you kind of experienced in the discussion internally, but, like, also, like, in terms of how you wanna position yourself then. Yeah. So at the core, you know, we declared being an AI-driven platform. Mm-hmm. human platform, about seven years ago, so we've adopted AI. Wow. Very, very early on. Yeah. In that transformation and believed that it could transform our experiences. ChatGPT and other LLMs came onto the scene and drove a lot of traffic, a lot of engagement with customers, but doing taxes, managing books, accounting, payroll, all the things that we do, it's not just about general questions and answers. Data is incredibly important. Security, accuracy, and confidence are all things that are incredibly important that Intuit has built into both the consumer platform and our technology platform so what we view with a ChatGPT, and we've already, we just announced our OpenAI agreement, is we need to go where customers are and what we love about what's happening there is obviously 800 million weekly active users, but it's a way to interact with a customer and get them into the right products that are best served for them, whether it's TurboTax, Credit Karma, or QuickBooks. That's what we view as the future as an opportunity, and less of a threat, and much more about meeting customers where they are, and helping them get the answers they need and then getting them into our products and solving their problems. Yeah. Was there, I mean, did you see it in the change in the ecosystem as well? If I think about the tax consultants, etc., did they kind of. Yeah. Or come down as well, or were they always, like. You know, I think there's always, like, in every transformation, I could tell you, in terms of, like, the tax professional. Yeah. You know, when we launched TurboTax Live eight years ago, one of the big fears that our experts had, our tax pros, was video. Yeah. And that was a big hurdle. And so there's changes is my point is very common, and you have to manage through it. We have about 13,000 tax pros on our platform. They absolutely love it. They're a little bit afraid at first. Mm-hmm. But they're much more worried about, "Am I able to do my job effectively a+nd drive the accuracy for my customer? Yeah. And so that's kind of the basis of their concern. And once we showed the capabilities and once we started doing and removing mundane tax tasks and actually enabling them to serve customers, which is what they really love to do, and solve those problems and drive confidence for those customers, they've really adopted AI. And we really don't see that as a challenge within our platform anymore. Yeah. Yeah. They're kind of over the change curve on that and actually see the benefit. And then as part of that, like, let's talk a little bit about, you know, TurboTax, you know, we wanna do assisted. We're kind of moving. Mm-hmm. In a way, upmarket. There seems to be, like, a huge opportunity because there's still so many people that are kind of doing that. Like, talk a little bit about the evolution of your capabilities and where you are on that journey. Yeah. So yeah, there are about 88 million Americans that still file their taxes through what we call the assisted category. Yeah. So it's a huge, huge market. It's about a $37 billion TAM. So it's, it's an enormous opportunity for us. The technology investments that we made starting seven, eight years ago in TurboTax Live have only gotten better and much more advanced, which enables us to serve more customers. That's the way we see it. Yeah. So it started with, I had talked about video. It started with being able to work from home and virtually. That all enabled us to start to scale. But AI, and generative AI in particular has accelerated our opportunities to serve those customers and move upmarket. Yeah. because our experts are no longer doing things that consume the time away from a consumer or away from a customer and actually empowers them to serve more and more customers because that work is being done for them. Yeah. Yeah. And so that's how we start to think about it. It also allowed us to branch into new types of services that we launched two years ago, but really last year was our first GA year: business tax. And small businesses and helping serve them because we could start to build a product using AI that was focused on our customers' behalf. AI is transformative for us in many ways, certainly in the product experience and our expert experience. But our developers are 40% more efficient with AI, right? So that enabled us to go build a Biztax platform, which would've taken us a long time before. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But because of how our developers are aided by AI and much more efficient, we could build faster. On a customer success side, as an example, we see this year about $135 million of efficiency opportunities. And that efficiency translates into our ability to serve more customers. Right? So it's very powerful for us across the board, customers, experiences, and our internal operations. What is the one of the messages that came from you guys for a long, long time on tax was that too many dropouts, like people started it, they didn't get comfortable? Mm-hmm. And then kind of dropped out, went to the tax guys then afterwards. Like, how is Gen AI in theory helping that? There should be the ability to do a lot more handholding while you interact with ChatGPT at the moment. Like, there's a lot of, like, handholding capabilities. Like, is that one of the factors that you kind of consider in terms of, like, changing that conversion rate? Yeah. Absolutely, and I like the handholding term. It really is, as I had mentioned earlier, TurboTax was a very linear interview process that required everybody to go through hundreds of questions, and that's where you saw a bunch of fatigue, right? Mm-hmm. Because many of the questions didn't really apply to you as an individual, and what we've built now is an AI-driven experience that uses data. Yeah. to actually personalize that experience and only offer up the questions that are relevant to you, which shortens the time for you to actually complete your taxes. We saw a 12% reduction last year in tax prep, and we expect further refinements in that. That creates confidence, and then what it also enables us to do is infuse Human Intelligence. You know, we talk about AI and HI. Yeah. And that has been infused into our product, which really helps with the confidence factor of getting the most refund or paying the absolute required payments that you have to make if you owe money. So it's very, very important, the combination of AI plus HI. Yeah. And then where do you see that market in a way ultimately play out? Like, is there a certain limit how much of a tax return you can do, and at some point it just gets too complex, or is now, like, the ability is there? In theory, everything is just that inertia on the consumer side that is these two ends of. Yeah. In terms of being able to do it. Yeah. Driven through AI. We believe, so AI for us. And assisted, yeah. AI for the, yeah. Yeah. It's the combination of the two, AI plus HI, but also within our HI capabilities, generative AI is a component, right? LLMs are a component of our offering, or our ability to deliver. But we also have advanced machine learning. Yeah. In there as well, which is really also helping us drive breakthrough, and so when you look at our products next year, it'll be 90% enabled by HI, and then once, and but it's less about doing your taxes in that way. That's a great confidence builder for customers. It's also the knowledge that you have a human that can help you answer that last-mile question or give you that last-mile of confidence that you're doing everything right and you're maximizing your return. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, and how do you think the, I'm kind of leading to that. Yeah. Famous question from the analyst of the long-term ambition of 20%. Mm-hmm. You're a part of that. You're a part of the organization. If you think about that, like, if you like doing more assisted drive growth, you know, like, you know, you get more people in there, you know, and potentially at a higher price point. How do you think about that trajectory in terms of how you can kind of do that from a timing perspective? Like, you know, is this kind of like a gradual uplift? Do you think, like, you know, a little bit this year and then step changes because more and more people get comfortable? How do you think about that? Yeah. Certainly the 20% is an aspirational target. I know. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Internally and. Yeah. It's meant to motivate us. What we do believe is that by focusing on the consumer problems or the small business problems, we have an opportunity to get to a 20% growth company. And with the advent of and the emergence of generative AI plus our Human intelligence, we have an opportunity to solve more of those problems more frequently. So we have an incredible consumer platform that goes well beyond taxes now. Credit Karma helps customers manage their credit. It helps them get the best loan. It helps them save money. So that flywheel within that consumer platform allows us to be a much more relevant part of our consumers' lives every single day, which then gives us opportunities to serve them and drive towards that 20% growth in the consumer platform. The same thing can be said for our business platform as well. Yeah. That's their challenge too. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It is how you're. Yeah. Talking a little bit about the different groups. So on our side, we all focus on, like, okay, we have a big assisted category. You guys move upmarket, more cons more customers there that you can deal with that you never dealt with at the higher price point. Thank you very much. But the lower end is still kind of important because it's the younger generation often come like that, the top of the funnel. Talk a little bit about what you're seeing there in terms of trends. Yeah. So certainly, digital native mobile is at the forefront of our Gen Z strategy. We're also very aware of price sensitivities there. So we've launched breakthrough offers like our mobile app offer that is a free offer for new customers to file their taxes for free. But it's also what we see is that Gen Z in particular has a real desire and still has confidence issues and likes to engage with our expert system, and so we're trying to make that much more accessible to them through our mobile experiences. We're decomposing our services, meeting them where they are with their questions, so that they can file confidently. Many of them are new, right, the first-time filers. Yeah. And so it's a very daunting experience because there's a lot of fear associated with that. For many of them, most of them, it's a very large refund. And so they want access to that. So we also look at how can we provide value-added services that are meaningful to them. Things like fast access to money or five days early product was very popular because they no matter what they want their money as fast as possible. And so that's how we think about addressing that category. We also believe that within Credit Karma and the 140 million member base that we have there, it's a large population to be able to help because as they're engaging with Credit Karma to get credit cards or get personal loans, it's a natural extension at this time of year for them to come in and start to do taxes. Yeah. Yeah. And we're making that very easy for them to do that. And then, have you seen any change in terms of who you're kind of seeing there? It looks you used to, you know, it's, you know, the classic H&R Block that was always there, TaxAct. It's like, do you see any changes in terms of someone new coming up, or is there the world changing there? Yeah. So what we do see is they love mobile. Yeah. They expect everything to be. Yeah. On their mobile device. They embrace these new ways of engaging with our experts, right? So we're not a traditional assisted. We have a lot of capabilities that are natively embedded in their app. So the app plays a huge part of attracting that customer base. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And then we do know that they're also heavily engaged in OpenAI and ChatGPTs. And so we need to be in those categories and helping answer their questions as they're asking them in those LLMs as well. And we're very excited about what we're doing with OpenAI over the coming month here to embed our experiences for the ChatGPT users. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Perfect. And then moving on a little bit, Credit Karma, it was more cyclical than we initially kind of thought. Now it looks like we're kind of coming out the other end. Like, can you talk a little bit about your learnings from, you know, when you started to own the asset to kind of now, your learnings and how that's kind of influencing what you want to do with it going forward? Yeah. This is where we believe there's just an incredible opportunity to help customers make more personal finance decisions daily. Yeah. Our focus right now is really how do we drive that engagement on a daily basis with our Credit Karma members? We're deploying a fleet of agents that we're calling assistants starting with like a refund assistant. You know, you get a. Yeah. A $4,000 check through tax. What do you do with it, right? What do you do with that money? And what's the best application for it? So our refund assistant will know what kind of what's your debt portfolio, right? 57% of Credit Karma members have revolving debt. So we can help them make better financial decisions based on that moment in time. Yeah. Yeah. That they get that big refund, maybe pay off some of that debt, maybe rotate it into something that's more advantageous for them. How do you set up high-yield savings and really start to get them on a journey of financial health, right? We also have the debt assistant that'll be constantly working in the background for our members, and surface opportunities for them to make better debt decisions on a year-round basis. We have Credit Spark. Credit is a huge problem for Gen Z, right? Yeah. Not a problem, but it's a. Yeah. Yeah. They're new to it. So Credit Spark is an agent that we're deploying, that will look at where their spending habits are and make recommendations and for them to leverage, like, things like utilities or rent and to improving their credit score real-time. That will be very powerful for them as they start their financial journey. Yeah. Yeah. That's how we think about Credit Karma. It's an incredible platform that has 43 million monthly active users, and that just gives us an incredible opportunity to engage every day in those everyday decisions that members have to make. What can you do there on the product side or the offering side to kind of maybe remove some of the cyclicality? Remember we kind of started with like 25% plus growth, then we went kind of. Yeah. I remember. And we went down. Now we're coming back up again. Like, is there anything to way to smooth it out, or is that kind of something that we kind of need to appreciate it? Yeah. This is what it is. Yeah. Yeah. No. It's a great question. So one, there is experience, and that's really solving more problems for customers, right, and members, right? So that's all the agent work that we're doing, that I had talked about. And that's all based on the data that we have on customers, and them, and their connected accounts. And that allows us to spread our risks. Many years ago, we were largely a credit card business. Now we've expanded verticals as well, right? We've got personal loans that's growing. Yeah. Significantly. We've got insurance. We've got new markets and new opportunities in other areas like home, and we have Credit Karma Money that we need to invest in. That's a daily app. So there's also an expansion of the services that we can offer for customers. Yeah. and that will spread out risk and also enable us to, in good times, right, in good macro times or maybe bad macro times, be able to offer the financial advice that they need, and take action against. And that's really the promise that we see within the Credit Karma platform. Yeah. Yeah. And then, is there, if you think about Credit Karma connects to TurboTax, if you think about it, also go to the other side of QuickBooks, like, how is that connection? Is there like. Oh, quick. Yeah. Yeah. There is a cohort of small businesses within Credit Karma that we can offer business loans to for sure. Yeah. And that's actively worked. But what we're really excited is with our business tax offering, right? Because that job to be done taxes for a small business is very difficult and can be very impactful to the operations of their business. And so we deployed Biztax last year at scale, and we were very excited about the breakthrough that we got there. What we have an opportunity to do is that moment in time that they're filing their taxes is to start to establish a relationship with them through QuickBooks. Yeah. On a year-round basis, and there's a lot of opportunity because not all of our customers are already QuickBooks customers that are coming in. That allows us to then really get them into a QuickBooks product that's right for them that helps them manage their finances year-round versus coming to us with a spreadsheet and saying, "What do I do? How do I file my taxes? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. and so that's another flywheel, if you will, within the broader Intuit ecosystem that we're really excited about. Yeah. Okay. In the last few minutes I want to spend, like, as we're moving closer towards the tax season now, we're in December. Yeah. Like, you talked a little bit about making your onboarding easier. Like, how do you think about the new tax season if you kind of plan it out? Like, is it kind of what I learned last time around, like try to change it, or like how does that process work for you? Yeah. So, there was a lot that we learned through last tax season that carries forward into this year. Yeah. And there's a lot more new innovation that we're deploying. So we're very excited about this tax season. One, we have been deeply embedded within Credit Karma, and those monthly interactions are helping us smooth that onboarding experience and really make it much more natural to go from Credit Karma. Yeah. To TurboTax. Data experiences. The other is, we're going big with our local presence, right? We're opening up 600 service centers, 20 retail stores, roughly 20, and one flagship. And what that does is it unlocks the whole category of customers that are interested in someone doing their taxes that's close to them. And when we did that last year, and we did it towards the tail end of last year, we saw a 5X engagement rate with our experts. And so we've really refined and built some incredible new innovation that's going to allow us to meet those customers in the communities that they're in, with the best expert network that's out there in the industry. Yeah. What's the, I mean, the counter argument with that is like you're rebuilding what was there before. Like, what's different about this local versus. One is our brand. Yeah. Our brand is super powerful. Two is that we're a technology-first view, so in our platform, and so you don't have to come in with papers. You don't have to come in with anything. You just show up. Yeah. And then we can engage with you, and then we connect all your accounts, and that's when the magic happens. And it's much faster. Yeah. Right? So that we really focus on an experience. Our price points are very attractive for our full service. Yeah. and then you get fast access to money, right? Again, it all comes down to the money and how fast can I get it into my account for a vast majority of Americans. Yeah. Yeah. and that's where we're really uniquely positioned over any other service. And then now with Credit Karma, we can take that refund and make it go much further, right? And so that's the last, you know, the last. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. step, that keeps us engaged, and they come back to us yearly. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And with it, you know, the 5X engagement was a massive breakthrough for us because it was within a 50-mile radius, right, of an expert. We're like, "Okay. That means a lot," right? Yeah. Being local means a lot to consumers, and so we're doubling down on that. Yeah. Yeah. That's a kind of, yeah, that's after all these years, there's a new learning, yeah? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's, that's what's fun about experimenting. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No. Okay. That's interesting. Then last question for me, so there's the growth and you kind of guide for that. There's also then the profitability envelope that you have to kind of achieve those things. Like. Mm-hmm. Talk a little bit about that dynamic of growth versus margins that, you know, you have to live with. Yeah. We manage at a portfolio level, right? We have many different ways that customers monetize with us, and that gives us a lot of flexibility to lean in. Yeah. And look at it at a portfolio level. It is something that, you know, we as a team and the consumer group, and I know they do in the business team as well, look at every day and how do we make those investments and how do we model those investments that may show monetization somewhere else. Yeah. Yeah. but we get engaged a customer is really what we need to stay focused on. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Perfect. Same, that's a good closing statement, actually. Okay. Perfect. Thank you, Mark. Thank you. I really enjoyed our conversation. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks. Thank you. All right. Thanks. Appreciate it.

Speaker 1: Hey, as everyone streams in here, welcome to our next session. Really happy to have you on here with us, Mark. Maybe just talk a little bit about yourself and your role at Intuit, and then we can take it from there. Hey, as everyone streams in here, welcome to our next session. hey as everyone streams in here welcome to our next session Really happy to have you on here with us, Mark. really happy to have you on here with us mark Maybe just talk a little bit about yourself and your role at Intuit, and then we can take it from there. maybe just talk a little bit about yourself and your role at intuit and then we can take it from there

Speaker 2: Sure, sure. Yeah, hi, I'm Mark Notarainni. I have the pleasure of leading our consumer team within TurboTax or within Intuit, and that really encompasses TurboTax, Credit Karma, and our ProTax group, so really serving consumers' financial needs. I've been with Intuit now for 18 years in this role for coming up on three now, super excited to be here and really looking forward to talk about the future of our consumer platform. Sure, sure. sure sure Yeah, hi, I'm Mark Notarainni. yeah hi i'm mark notarainni I have the pleasure of leading our consumer team within TurboTax or within Intuit, and that really encompasses TurboTax, Credit Karma, and our ProTax group, so really serving consumers' financial needs. i have the pleasure of leading our consumer team within turbotax or within intuit and that really encompasses turbotax credit karma and our protax group so really serving consumers' financial needs I've been with Intuit now for 18 years in this role for coming up on three now, super excited to be here and really looking forward to talk about the future of our consumer platform. i've been with intuit now for 18 years in this role for coming up on three now super excited to be here and really looking forward to talk about the future of our consumer platform

Speaker 1: And it's kind of funny because, like, you can't go to these tech conferences and don't start on AI, you know, to talk about AI for any reason. And it's kind of funny because, like, you can't go to these tech conferences and don't start on AI, you know, to talk about AI for any reason. and it's kind of funny because like you can't go to these tech conferences and don't start on ai you know to talk about ai for any reason

Speaker 2: Oh, yeah. Yeah, that's kind of a big deal. Oh, yeah. oh yeah Yeah, that's kind of a big deal. yeah that's kind of a big deal

Speaker 1: Yeah. Weirdly enough, I don't know why. Can you talk a little bit about the thinking from the Intuit management team, how that has evolved in terms of, like, what AI means for you guys? Yeah. yeah Weirdly enough, I don't know why. weirdly enough i don't know why Can you talk a little bit about the thinking from the Intuit management team, how that has evolved in terms of, like, what AI means for you guys? can you talk a little bit about the thinking from the intuit management team how that has evolved in terms of like what ai means for you guys

Speaker 2: Yeah, AI is an incredible opportunity for us across all of Intuit, both our business platform and our consumer platform, and it really enables us to do done-for-you experiences for customers, right, so we've been in the case of TurboTax an incredible platform that's been driven by a linear interview process, and what AI has enabled us to do is ingest data, apply data, and personalize an experience that basically enables us to do much more of a done-for-you experience, bringing your data, get the work done for you without having to put in information, and then get you the best outcome so that you could finish and file. In the case of TurboTax, in Credit Karma, it enables us to be much more helpful to a customer because of the data points that we have. Yeah, AI is an incredible opportunity for us across all of Intuit, both our business platform and our consumer platform, and it really enables us to do done-for-you experiences for customers, right, so we've been in the case of TurboTax an incredible platform that's been driven by a linear interview process, and what AI has enabled us to do is ingest data, apply data, and personalize an experience that basically enables us to do much more of a done-for-you experience, bringing your data, get the work done for you without having to put in information, and then get you the best outcome so that you could finish and file. yeah ai is an incredible opportunity for us across all of intuit both our business platform and our consumer platform and it really enables us to do done-for-you experiences for customers right so we've been in the case of turbotax an incredible platform that's been driven by a linear interview process and what ai has enabled us to do is ingest data apply data and personalize an experience that basically enables us to do much more of a done-for-you experience bringing your data get the work done for you without having to put in information and then get you the best outcome so that you could finish and file In the case of TurboTax, in Credit Karma, it enables us to be much more helpful to a customer because of the data points that we have. in the case of turbotax in credit karma it enables us to be much more helpful to a customer because of the data points that we have We have about 70,000 data points on each consumer, and that enables us to actually personalize experiences, beyond credit cards into personal loans, into debt and debt management. And so really, truly becoming a daily interactive product for our consumers and solving real problems every single day. That's all enabled by AI. We have about 70,000 data points on each consumer, and that enables us to actually personalize experiences, beyond credit cards into personal loans, into debt and debt management. we have about 70,000 data points on each consumer and that enables us to actually personalize experiences beyond credit cards into personal loans into debt and debt management And so really, truly becoming a daily interactive product for our consumers and solving real problems every single day. and so really truly becoming a daily interactive product for our consumers and solving real problems every single day That's all enabled by AI. that's all enabled by ai

Speaker 1: Yeah. And then can you talk a little bit about the evolution or, like, the action you guys have taken to be ready for that? And there I'm thinking, like, there's, like, a harmonization of the technology. Yeah. yeah And then can you talk a little bit about the evolution or, like, the action you guys have taken to be ready for that? and then can you talk a little bit about the evolution or like the action you guys have taken to be ready for that And there I'm thinking, like, there's, like, a harmonization of the technology. and there i'm thinking like there's like a harmonization of the technology

Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. mm-hmm

Speaker 1: There's a data platform, etc. Like, you know, what you know, it sounds all very simple. It's like. There's a data platform, etc. Like, you know, what you know, it sounds all very simple. there's a data platform etc like you know what you know it sounds all very simple It's like. it's like

Speaker 2: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. oh yeah Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 1: And then, reality is often kind of a bit tougher to. And then, reality is often kind of a bit tougher to. and then reality is often kind of a bit tougher to

Speaker 2: Yeah. It is much harder. Yeah. So, you know, there's the first thing is making sure that we have the data organized, right? And that's a big part of our platform is our data and what we call our data services. So we have the ability to aggregate and collect data that's very important for driving your personal finances. So that's really a transformation that we had to drive. Our data was locked up in different products. And we had to organize it in a way where it could be consumed real-time by a product, and so that's been a big transformation. We also, in the case of TurboTax, right, we're a 40-year-old company, and so we had to modernize our platform across our tax product. We had to do that in QuickBooks as well 'cause it's been around. Yeah. yeah It is much harder. it is much harder Yeah. yeah So, you know, there's the first thing is making sure that we have the data organized, right? so you know there's the first thing is making sure that we have the data organized right And that's a big part of our platform is our data and what we call our data services. and that's a big part of our platform is our data and what we call our data services So we have the ability to aggregate and collect data that's very important for driving your personal finances. so we have the ability to aggregate and collect data that's very important for driving your personal finances So that's really a transformation that we had to drive. so that's really a transformation that we had to drive Our data was locked up in different products. our data was locked up in different products And we had to organize it in a way where it could be consumed real-time by a product, and so that's been a big transformation. and we had to organize it in a way where it could be consumed real-time by a product and so that's been a big transformation We also, in the case of TurboTax, right, we're a 40-year-old company, and so we had to modernize our platform across our tax product. we also in the case of turbotax right we're a 40-year-old company and so we had to modernize our platform across our tax product We had to do that in QuickBooks as well 'cause it's been around. we had to do that in quickbooks as well 'cause it's been around And one of the things that is very unique, and I think this is important for anybody going through an AI transformation, is you have to have the culture for change, so Intuit has been around for 40 years. Amazing. 40-plus years. We started off as a DOS company. It turns out that the technology they use for DOS doesn't work in the world of AI, and we've been able to migrate and manage through really big technology shifts. This one is super fast and more impactful than the internet or mobile for sure that preceded it, so it really, like, Intuit is a culture of change, and we just really leaned into it and adopted it and understood what it could do to solve customer problems. And one of the things that is very unique, and I think this is important for anybody going through an AI transformation, is you have to have the culture for change, so Intuit has been around for 40 years. and one of the things that is very unique and i think this is important for anybody going through an ai transformation is you have to have the culture for change so intuit has been around for 40 years Amazing. 40-plus years. amazing 40-plus years We started off as a DOS company. we started off as a dos company It turns out that the technology they use for DOS doesn't work in the world of AI, and we've been able to migrate and manage through really big technology shifts. it turns out that the technology they use for dos doesn't work in the world of ai and we've been able to migrate and manage through really big technology shifts This one is super fast and more impactful than the internet or mobile for sure that preceded it, so it really, like, Intuit is a culture of change, and we just really leaned into it and adopted it and understood what it could do to solve customer problems. this one is super fast and more impactful than the internet or mobile for sure that preceded it so it really like intuit is a culture of change and we just really leaned into it and adopted it and understood what it could do to solve customer problems

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: AI could do. Yeah. AI could do. ai could do Yeah. yeah

Speaker 1: If you think about that, at least, like, I don't know if you had it, but, like, when ChatGPT came out, there was this horror scenarios 'cause ChatGPT can do your taxes, you know, and then everyone's like, "Okay, well, I don't need TurboTax anymore," etc. If you think about that, at least, like, I don't know if you had it, but, like, when ChatGPT came out, there was this horror scenarios 'cause ChatGPT can do your taxes, you know, and then everyone's like, "Okay, well, I don't need TurboTax anymore," etc. if you think about that at least like i don't know if you had it but like when chatgpt came out there was this horror scenarios 'cause chatgpt can do your taxes you know and then everyone's like "okay well i don't need turbotax anymore," etc

Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 1: How, like, talk a little bit about the journey that you kind of experienced in the discussion internally, but, like, also, like, in terms of how you wanna position yourself then. How, like, talk a little bit about the journey that you kind of experienced in the discussion internally, but, like, also, like, in terms of how you wanna position yourself then. how like talk a little bit about the journey that you kind of experienced in the discussion internally but like also like in terms of how you wanna position yourself then

Speaker 2: Yeah. So at the core, you know, we declared being an AI-driven platform. Yeah. yeah So at the core, you know, we declared being an AI-driven platform. so at the core you know we declared being an ai-driven platform

Speaker 1: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. mm-hmm

Speaker 2: human platform, about seven years ago, so we've adopted AI. human platform, about seven years ago, so we've adopted AI. human platform about seven years ago so we've adopted ai

Speaker 1: Wow. Wow. wow

Speaker 2: Very, very early on. Very, very early on. very very early on

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: In that transformation and believed that it could transform our experiences. ChatGPT and other LLMs came onto the scene and drove a lot of traffic, a lot of engagement with customers, but doing taxes, managing books, accounting, payroll, all the things that we do, it's not just about general questions and answers. Data is incredibly important. Security, accuracy, and confidence are all things that are incredibly important that Intuit has built into both the consumer platform and our technology platform so what we view with a ChatGPT, and we've already, we just announced our OpenAI agreement, is we need to go where customers are and what we love about what's happening there is obviously 800 million weekly active users, but it's a way to interact with a customer and get them into the right products that are best served for them, whether it's TurboTax, Credit Karma, or QuickBooks. In that transformation and believed that it could transform our experiences. in that transformation and believed that it could transform our experiences ChatGPT and other LLMs came onto the scene and drove a lot of traffic, a lot of engagement with customers, but doing taxes, managing books, accounting, payroll, all the things that we do, it's not just about general questions and answers. chatgpt and other llms came onto the scene and drove a lot of traffic a lot of engagement with customers but doing taxes managing books accounting payroll all the things that we do it's not just about general questions and answers Data is incredibly important. data is incredibly important Security, accuracy, and confidence are all things that are incredibly important that Intuit has built into both the consumer platform and our technology platform so what we view with a ChatGPT, and we've already, we just announced our OpenAI agreement, is we need to go where customers are and what we love about what's happening there is obviously 800 million weekly active users, but it's a way to interact with a customer and get them into the right products that are best served for them, whether it's TurboTax, Credit Karma, or QuickBooks. security accuracy and confidence are all things that are incredibly important that intuit has built into both the consumer platform and our technology platform so what we view with a chatgpt and we've already we just announced our openai agreement is we need to go where customers are and what we love about what's happening there is obviously 800 million weekly active users but it's a way to interact with a customer and get them into the right products that are best served for them whether it's turbotax credit karma or quickbooks That's what we view as the future as an opportunity, and less of a threat, and much more about meeting customers where they are, and helping them get the answers they need and then getting them into our products and solving their problems. That's what we view as the future as an opportunity, and less of a threat, and much more about meeting customers where they are, and helping them get the answers they need and then getting them into our products and solving their problems. that's what we view as the future as an opportunity and less of a threat and much more about meeting customers where they are and helping them get the answers they need and then getting them into our products and solving their problems

Speaker 1: Yeah. Was there, I mean, did you see it in the change in the ecosystem as well? If I think about the tax consultants, etc., did they kind of. Yeah. yeah Was there, I mean, did you see it in the change in the ecosystem as well? was there i mean did you see it in the change in the ecosystem as well If I think about the tax consultants, etc., did they kind of. if i think about the tax consultants etc did they kind of

Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 1: Or come down as well, or were they always, like. Or come down as well, or were they always, like. or come down as well or were they always like

Speaker 2: You know, I think there's always, like, in every transformation, I could tell you, in terms of, like, the tax professional. You know, I think there's always, like, in every transformation, I could tell you, in terms of, like, the tax professional. you know i think there's always like in every transformation i could tell you in terms of like the tax professional

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: You know, when we launched TurboTax Live eight years ago, one of the big fears that our experts had, our tax pros, was video. You know, when we launched TurboTax Live eight years ago, one of the big fears that our experts had, our tax pros, was video. you know when we launched turbotax live eight years ago one of the big fears that our experts had our tax pros was video

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: And that was a big hurdle. And so there's changes is my point is very common, and you have to manage through it. We have about 13,000 tax pros on our platform. They absolutely love it. They're a little bit afraid at first. And that was a big hurdle. and that was a big hurdle And so there's changes is my point is very common, and you have to manage through it. and so there's changes is my point is very common and you have to manage through it We have about 13,000 tax pros on our platform. we have about 13,000 tax pros on our platform They absolutely love it. they absolutely love it They're a little bit afraid at first. they're a little bit afraid at first

Speaker 1: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. mm-hmm

Speaker 2: But they're much more worried about, "Am I able to do my job effectively a+nd drive the accuracy for my customer? But they're much more worried about, "Am I able to do my job effectively a+nd drive the accuracy for my customer? but they're much more worried about "am i able to do my job effectively a+nd drive the accuracy for my customer

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: And so that's kind of the basis of their concern. And once we showed the capabilities and once we started doing and removing mundane tax tasks and actually enabling them to serve customers, which is what they really love to do, and solve those problems and drive confidence for those customers, they've really adopted AI. And we really don't see that as a challenge within our platform anymore. And so that's kind of the basis of their concern. and so that's kind of the basis of their concern And once we showed the capabilities and once we started doing and removing mundane tax tasks and actually enabling them to serve customers, which is what they really love to do, and solve those problems and drive confidence for those customers, they've really adopted AI. and once we showed the capabilities and once we started doing and removing mundane tax tasks and actually enabling them to serve customers which is what they really love to do and solve those problems and drive confidence for those customers they've really adopted ai And we really don't see that as a challenge within our platform anymore. and we really don't see that as a challenge within our platform anymore

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: They're kind of over the change curve on that and actually see the benefit. They're kind of over the change curve on that and actually see the benefit. they're kind of over the change curve on that and actually see the benefit

Speaker 1: And then as part of that, like, let's talk a little bit about, you know, TurboTax, you know, we wanna do assisted. We're kind of moving. And then as part of that, like, let's talk a little bit about, you know, TurboTax, you know, we wanna do assisted. and then as part of that like let's talk a little bit about you know turbotax you know we wanna do assisted We're kind of moving. we're kind of moving

Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. mm-hmm

Speaker 1: In a way, upmarket. There seems to be, like, a huge opportunity because there's still so many people that are kind of doing that. Like, talk a little bit about the evolution of your capabilities and where you are on that journey. In a way, upmarket. in a way upmarket There seems to be, like, a huge opportunity because there's still so many people that are kind of doing that. there seems to be like a huge opportunity because there's still so many people that are kind of doing that Like, talk a little bit about the evolution of your capabilities and where you are on that journey. like talk a little bit about the evolution of your capabilities and where you are on that journey

Speaker 2: Yeah. So yeah, there are about 88 million Americans that still file their taxes through what we call the assisted category. Yeah. yeah So yeah, there are about 88 million Americans that still file their taxes through what we call the assisted category. so yeah there are about 88 million americans that still file their taxes through what we call the assisted category

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: So it's a huge, huge market. It's about a $37 billion TAM. So it's, it's an enormous opportunity for us. The technology investments that we made starting seven, eight years ago in TurboTax Live have only gotten better and much more advanced, which enables us to serve more customers. That's the way we see it. So it's a huge, huge market. so it's a huge huge market It's about a $37 billion TAM. it's about a $37 billion tam So it's, it's an enormous opportunity for us. so it's it's an enormous opportunity for us The technology investments that we made starting seven, eight years ago in TurboTax Live have only gotten better and much more advanced, which enables us to serve more customers. the technology investments that we made starting seven eight years ago in turbotax live have only gotten better and much more advanced which enables us to serve more customers That's the way we see it. that's the way we see it

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: So it started with, I had talked about video. It started with being able to work from home and virtually. That all enabled us to start to scale. But AI, and generative AI in particular has accelerated our opportunities to serve those customers and move upmarket. So it started with, I had talked about video. so it started with i had talked about video It started with being able to work from home and virtually. it started with being able to work from home and virtually That all enabled us to start to scale. that all enabled us to start to scale But AI, and generative AI in particular has accelerated our opportunities to serve those customers and move upmarket. but ai and generative ai in particular has accelerated our opportunities to serve those customers and move upmarket

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: because our experts are no longer doing things that consume the time away from a consumer or away from a customer and actually empowers them to serve more and more customers because that work is being done for them. because our experts are no longer doing things that consume the time away from a consumer or away from a customer and actually empowers them to serve more and more customers because that work is being done for them. because our experts are no longer doing things that consume the time away from a consumer or away from a customer and actually empowers them to serve more and more customers because that work is being done for them

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: And so that's how we start to think about it. It also allowed us to branch into new types of services that we launched two years ago, but really last year was our first GA year: business tax. And small businesses and helping serve them because we could start to build a product using AI that was focused on our customers' behalf. AI is transformative for us in many ways, certainly in the product experience and our expert experience. But our developers are 40% more efficient with AI, right? So that enabled us to go build a Biztax platform, which would've taken us a long time before. And so that's how we start to think about it. and so that's how we start to think about it It also allowed us to branch into new types of services that we launched two years ago, but really last year was our first GA year: business tax. it also allowed us to branch into new types of services that we launched two years ago but really last year was our first ga year business tax And small businesses and helping serve them because we could start to build a product using AI that was focused on our customers' behalf. and small businesses and helping serve them because we could start to build a product using ai that was focused on our customers' behalf AI is transformative for us in many ways, certainly in the product experience and our expert experience. ai is transformative for us in many ways certainly in the product experience and our expert experience But our developers are 40% more efficient with AI, right? but our developers are 40% more efficient with ai right So that enabled us to go build a Biztax platform, which would've taken us a long time before. so that enabled us to go build a biztax platform which would've taken us a long time before

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: But because of how our developers are aided by AI and much more efficient, we could build faster. On a customer success side, as an example, we see this year about $135 million of efficiency opportunities. And that efficiency translates into our ability to serve more customers. Right? So it's very powerful for us across the board, customers, experiences, and our internal operations. But because of how our developers are aided by AI and much more efficient, we could build faster. but because of how our developers are aided by ai and much more efficient we could build faster On a customer success side, as an example, we see this year about $135 million of efficiency opportunities. on a customer success side as an example we see this year about $135 million of efficiency opportunities And that efficiency translates into our ability to serve more customers. and that efficiency translates into our ability to serve more customers Right? right So it's very powerful for us across the board, customers, experiences, and our internal operations. so it's very powerful for us across the board customers experiences and our internal operations

Speaker 1: What is the one of the messages that came from you guys for a long, long time on tax was that too many dropouts, like people started it, they didn't get comfortable? What is the one of the messages that came from you guys for a long, long time on tax was that too many dropouts, like people started it, they didn't get comfortable? what is the one of the messages that came from you guys for a long long time on tax was that too many dropouts like people started it they didn't get comfortable

Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. mm-hmm

Speaker 1: And then kind of dropped out, went to the tax guys then afterwards. Like, how is Gen AI in theory helping that? There should be the ability to do a lot more handholding while you interact with ChatGPT at the moment. Like, there's a lot of, like, handholding capabilities. Like, is that one of the factors that you kind of consider in terms of, like, changing that conversion rate? And then kind of dropped out, went to the tax guys then afterwards. and then kind of dropped out went to the tax guys then afterwards Like, how is Gen AI in theory helping that? like how is gen ai in theory helping that there There should be the ability to do a lot more handholding while you interact with ChatGPT at the moment. there should be the ability to do a lot more handholding while you interact with chatgpt at the moment Like, there's a lot of, like, handholding capabilities. like there's a lot of like handholding capabilities Like, is that one of the factors that you kind of consider in terms of, like, changing that conversion rate? like is that one of the factors that you kind of consider in terms of like changing that conversion rate

Speaker 2: Yeah. Absolutely, and I like the handholding term. It really is, as I had mentioned earlier, TurboTax was a very linear interview process that required everybody to go through hundreds of questions, and that's where you saw a bunch of fatigue, right? Yeah. yeah Absolutely, and I like the handholding term. absolutely and i like the handholding term It really is, as I had mentioned earlier, TurboTax was a very linear interview process that required everybody to go through hundreds of questions, and that's where you saw a bunch of fatigue, right? it really is as i had mentioned earlier turbotax was a very linear interview process that required everybody to go through hundreds of questions and that's where you saw a bunch of fatigue right

Speaker 1: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. mm-hmm

Speaker 2: Because many of the questions didn't really apply to you as an individual, and what we've built now is an AI-driven experience that uses data. Because many of the questions didn't really apply to you as an individual, and what we've built now is an AI-driven experience that uses data. because many of the questions didn't really apply to you as an individual and what we've built now is an ai-driven experience that uses data

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: to actually personalize that experience and only offer up the questions that are relevant to you, which shortens the time for you to actually complete your taxes. We saw a 12% reduction last year in tax prep, and we expect further refinements in that. That creates confidence, and then what it also enables us to do is infuse Human Intelligence. You know, we talk about AI and HI. to actually personalize that experience and only offer up the questions that are relevant to you, which shortens the time for you to actually complete your taxes. to actually personalize that experience and only offer up the questions that are relevant to you which shortens the time for you to actually complete your taxes We saw a 12% reduction last year in tax prep, and we expect further refinements in that. we saw a 12% reduction last year in tax prep and we expect further refinements in that That creates confidence, and then what it also enables us to do is infuse Human Intelligence. that creates confidence and then what it also enables us to do is infuse human intelligence You know, we talk about AI and HI. you know we talk about ai and hi

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: And that has been infused into our product, which really helps with the confidence factor of getting the most refund or paying the absolute required payments that you have to make if you owe money. So it's very, very important, the combination of AI plus HI. And that has been infused into our product, which really helps with the confidence factor of getting the most refund or paying the absolute required payments that you have to make if you owe money. and that has been infused into our product which really helps with the confidence factor of getting the most refund or paying the absolute required payments that you have to make if you owe money So it's very, very important, the combination of AI plus HI. so it's very very important the combination of ai plus hi

Speaker 1: Yeah. And then where do you see that market in a way ultimately play out? Like, is there a certain limit how much of a tax return you can do, and at some point it just gets too complex, or is now, like, the ability is there? In theory, everything is just that inertia on the consumer side that is these two ends of. Yeah. yeah And then where do you see that market in a way ultimately play out? and then where do you see that market in a way ultimately play out Like, is there a certain limit how much of a tax return you can do, and at some point it just gets too complex, or is now, like, the ability is there? like is there a certain limit how much of a tax return you can do and at some point it just gets too complex or is now like the ability is there In theory, everything is just that inertia on the consumer side that is these two ends of. in theory everything is just that inertia on the consumer side that is these two ends of

Speaker 2: Yeah. In terms of being able to do it. Yeah. yeah In terms of being able to do it. in terms of being able to do it

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: Driven through AI. We believe, so AI for us. Driven through AI. driven through ai We believe, so AI for us. we believe so ai for us

Speaker 1: And assisted, yeah. AI for the, yeah. And assisted, yeah. and assisted yeah AI for the, yeah. ai for the yeah

Speaker 2: Yeah. It's the combination of the two, AI plus HI, but also within our HI capabilities, generative AI is a component, right? LLMs are a component of our offering, or our ability to deliver. But we also have advanced machine learning. Yeah. yeah It's the combination of the two, AI plus HI, but also within our HI capabilities, generative AI is a component, right? it's the combination of the two ai plus hi but also within our hi capabilities generative ai is a component right LLMs are a component of our offering, or our ability to deliver. llms are a component of our offering or our ability to deliver But we also have advanced machine learning. but we also have advanced machine learning

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: In there as well, which is really also helping us drive breakthrough, and so when you look at our products next year, it'll be 90% enabled by HI, and then once, and but it's less about doing your taxes in that way. That's a great confidence builder for customers. It's also the knowledge that you have a human that can help you answer that last-mile question or give you that last-mile of confidence that you're doing everything right and you're maximizing your return. In there as well, which is really also helping us drive breakthrough, and so when you look at our products next year, it'll be 90% enabled by HI, and then once, and but it's less about doing your taxes in that way. in there as well which is really also helping us drive breakthrough and so when you look at our products next year it'll be 90% enabled by hi and then once and but it's less about doing your taxes in that way That's a great confidence builder for customers. that's a great confidence builder for customers It's also the knowledge that you have a human that can help you answer that last-mile question or give you that last-mile of confidence that you're doing everything right and you're maximizing your return. it's also the knowledge that you have a human that can help you answer that last-mile question or give you that last-mile of confidence that you're doing everything right and you're maximizing your return

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, and how do you think the, I'm kind of leading to that. Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah I mean, and how do you think the, I'm kind of leading to that. i mean and how do you think the i'm kind of leading to that

Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 1: Famous question from the analyst of the long-term ambition of 20%. Famous question from the analyst of the long-term ambition of 20%. famous question from the analyst of the long-term ambition of 20%

Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. mm-hmm

Speaker 1: You're a part of that. You're a part of the organization. If you think about that, like, if you like doing more assisted drive growth, you know, like, you know, you get more people in there, you know, and potentially at a higher price point. How do you think about that trajectory in terms of how you can kind of do that from a timing perspective? Like, you know, is this kind of like a gradual uplift? Do you think, like, you know, a little bit this year and then step changes because more and more people get comfortable? How do you think about that? You're a part of that. you're a part of that You're a part of the organization. you're a part of the organization If you think about that, like, if you like doing more assisted drive growth, you know, like, you know, you get more people in there, you know, and potentially at a higher price point. if you think about that like if you like doing more assisted drive growth you know like you know you get more people in there you know and potentially at a higher price point How do you think about that trajectory in terms of how you can kind of do that from a timing perspective? how do you think about that trajectory in terms of how you can kind of do that from a timing perspective Like, you know, is this kind of like a gradual uplift? like you know is this kind of like a gradual uplift Do you think, like, you know, a little bit this year and then step changes because more and more people get comfortable? do you think like you know a little bit this year and then step changes because more and more people get comfortable How do you think about that? how do you think about that

Speaker 2: Yeah. Certainly the 20% is an aspirational target. Yeah. yeah Certainly the 20% is an aspirational target. certainly the 20% is an aspirational target

Speaker 1: I know. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I know. i know Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: Internally and. Internally and. internally and

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: It's meant to motivate us. What we do believe is that by focusing on the consumer problems or the small business problems, we have an opportunity to get to a 20% growth company. And with the advent of and the emergence of generative AI plus our Human intelligence, we have an opportunity to solve more of those problems more frequently. So we have an incredible consumer platform that goes well beyond taxes now. Credit Karma helps customers manage their credit. It helps them get the best loan. It helps them save money. So that flywheel within that consumer platform allows us to be a much more relevant part of our consumers' lives every single day, which then gives us opportunities to serve them and drive towards that 20% growth in the consumer platform. It's meant to motivate us. it's meant to motivate us What we do believe is that by focusing on the consumer problems or the small business problems, we have an opportunity to get to a 20% growth company. what we do believe is that by focusing on the consumer problems or the small business problems we have an opportunity to get to a 20% growth company And with the advent of and the emergence of generative AI plus our Human intelligence, we have an opportunity to solve more of those problems more frequently. and with the advent of and the emergence of generative ai plus our human intelligence we have an opportunity to solve more of those problems more frequently So we have an incredible consumer platform that goes well beyond taxes now. so we have an incredible consumer platform that goes well beyond taxes now Credit Karma helps customers manage their credit. credit karma helps customers manage their credit It helps them get the best loan. it helps them get the best loan It helps them save money. it helps them save money So that flywheel within that consumer platform allows us to be a much more relevant part of our consumers' lives every single day, which then gives us opportunities to serve them and drive towards that 20% growth in the consumer platform. so that flywheel within that consumer platform allows us to be a much more relevant part of our consumers' lives every single day which then gives us opportunities to serve them and drive towards that 20% growth in the consumer platform The same thing can be said for our business platform as well. The same thing can be said for our business platform as well. the same thing can be said for our business platform as well

Speaker 1: Yeah. That's their challenge too. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It is how you're. Yeah. yeah That's their challenge too. that's their challenge too Yeah, yeah, yeah. yeah yeah yeah it It is how you're. it is how you're

Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 1: Talking a little bit about the different groups. So on our side, we all focus on, like, okay, we have a big assisted category. You guys move upmarket, more cons more customers there that you can deal with that you never dealt with at the higher price point. Thank you very much. But the lower end is still kind of important because it's the younger generation often come like that, the top of the funnel. Talk a little bit about what you're seeing there in terms of trends. Talking a little bit about the different groups. talking a little bit about the different groups So on our side, we all focus on, like, okay, we have a big assisted category. so on our side we all focus on like okay we have a big assisted category You guys move upmarket, more cons more customers there that you can deal with that you never dealt with at the higher price point. you guys move upmarket more cons more customers there that you can deal with that you never dealt with at the higher price point Thank you very much. thank you very much But the lower end is still kind of important because it's the younger generation often come like that, the top of the funnel. but the lower end is still kind of important because it's the younger generation often come like that the top of the funnel Talk a little bit about what you're seeing there in terms of trends. talk a little bit about what you're seeing there in terms of trends

Speaker 2: Yeah. So certainly, digital native mobile is at the forefront of our Gen Z strategy. We're also very aware of price sensitivities there. So we've launched breakthrough offers like our mobile app offer that is a free offer for new customers to file their taxes for free. But it's also what we see is that Gen Z in particular has a real desire and still has confidence issues and likes to engage with our expert system, and so we're trying to make that much more accessible to them through our mobile experiences. We're decomposing our services, meeting them where they are with their questions, so that they can file confidently. Many of them are new, right, the first-time filers. Yeah. yeah So certainly, digital native mobile is at the forefront of our Gen Z strategy. so certainly digital native mobile is at the forefront of our gen z strategy We're also very aware of price sensitivities there. we're also very aware of price sensitivities there So we've launched breakthrough offers like our mobile app offer that is a free offer for new customers to file their taxes for free. so we've launched breakthrough offers like our mobile app offer that is a free offer for new customers to file their taxes for free But it's also what we see is that Gen Z in particular has a real desire and still has confidence issues and likes to engage with our expert system, and so we're trying to make that much more accessible to them through our mobile experiences. but it's also what we see is that gen z in particular has a real desire and still has confidence issues and likes to engage with our expert system and so we're trying to make that much more accessible to them through our mobile experiences We're decomposing our services, meeting them where they are with their questions, so that they can file confidently. we're decomposing our services meeting them where they are with their questions so that they can file confidently Many of them are new, right, the first-time filers. many of them are new right the first-time filers

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: And so it's a very daunting experience because there's a lot of fear associated with that. For many of them, most of them, it's a very large refund. And so they want access to that. So we also look at how can we provide value-added services that are meaningful to them. Things like fast access to money or five days early product was very popular because they no matter what they want their money as fast as possible. And so that's how we think about addressing that category. And so it's a very daunting experience because there's a lot of fear associated with that. and so it's a very daunting experience because there's a lot of fear associated with that For many of them, most of them, it's a very large refund. for many of them most of them it's a very large refund And so they want access to that. and so they want access to that So we also look at how can we provide value-added services that are meaningful to them. so we also look at how can we provide value-added services that are meaningful to them Things like fast access to money or five days early product was very popular because they no matter what they want their money as fast as possible. things like fast access to money or five days early product was very popular because they no matter what they want their money as fast as possible And so that's how we think about addressing that category. and so that's how we think about addressing that category We also believe that within Credit Karma and the 140 million member base that we have there, it's a large population to be able to help because as they're engaging with Credit Karma to get credit cards or get personal loans, it's a natural extension at this time of year for them to come in and start to do taxes. We also believe that within Credit Karma and the 140 million member base that we have there, it's a large population to be able to help because as they're engaging with Credit Karma to get credit cards or get personal loans, it's a natural extension at this time of year for them to come in and start to do taxes. we also believe that within credit karma and the 140 million member base that we have there it's a large population to be able to help because as they're engaging with credit karma to get credit cards or get personal loans it's a natural extension at this time of year for them to come in and start to do taxes

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: And we're making that very easy for them to do that. And we're making that very easy for them to do that. and we're making that very easy for them to do that

Speaker 1: And then, have you seen any change in terms of who you're kind of seeing there? It looks you used to, you know, it's, you know, the classic H&R Block that was always there, TaxAct. It's like, do you see any changes in terms of someone new coming up, or is there the world changing there? And then, have you seen any change in terms of who you're kind of seeing there? and then have you seen any change in terms of who you're kind of seeing there It looks you used to, you know, it's, you know, the classic H&R Block that was always there, TaxAct. it looks you used to you know it's you know the classic h&r block that was always there taxact It's like, do you see any changes in terms of someone new coming up, or is there the world changing there? it's like do you see any changes in terms of someone new coming up or is there the world changing there

Speaker 2: Yeah. So what we do see is they love mobile. Yeah. yeah So what we do see is they love mobile. so what we do see is they love mobile

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: They expect everything to be. They expect everything to be. they expect everything to be

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: On their mobile device. They embrace these new ways of engaging with our experts, right? So we're not a traditional assisted. We have a lot of capabilities that are natively embedded in their app. So the app plays a huge part of attracting that customer base. On their mobile device. on their mobile device They embrace these new ways of engaging with our experts, right? they embrace these new ways of engaging with our experts right So we're not a traditional assisted. so we're not a traditional assisted We have a lot of capabilities that are natively embedded in their app. we have a lot of capabilities that are natively embedded in their app So the app plays a huge part of attracting that customer base. so the app plays a huge part of attracting that customer base

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: And then we do know that they're also heavily engaged in OpenAI and ChatGPTs. And so we need to be in those categories and helping answer their questions as they're asking them in those LLMs as well. And we're very excited about what we're doing with OpenAI over the coming month here to embed our experiences for the ChatGPT users. And then we do know that they're also heavily engaged in OpenAI and ChatGPTs. and then we do know that they're also heavily engaged in openai and chatgpts And so we need to be in those categories and helping answer their questions as they're asking them in those LLMs as well. and so we need to be in those categories and helping answer their questions as they're asking them in those llms as well And we're very excited about what we're doing with OpenAI over the coming month here to embed our experiences for the ChatGPT users. and we're very excited about what we're doing with openai over the coming month here to embed our experiences for the chatgpt users

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Perfect. And then moving on a little bit, Credit Karma, it was more cyclical than we initially kind of thought. Now it looks like we're kind of coming out the other end. Like, can you talk a little bit about your learnings from, you know, when you started to own the asset to kind of now, your learnings and how that's kind of influencing what you want to do with it going forward? Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah Okay. okay Perfect. perfect And then moving on a little bit, Credit Karma, it was more cyclical than we initially kind of thought. and then moving on a little bit credit karma it was more cyclical than we initially kind of thought Now it looks like we're kind of coming out the other end. now it looks like we're kind of coming out the other end Like, can you talk a little bit about your learnings from, you know, when you started to own the asset to kind of now, your learnings and how that's kind of influencing what you want to do with it going forward? like can you talk a little bit about your learnings from you know when you started to own the asset to kind of now your learnings and how that's kind of influencing what you want to do with it going forward

Speaker 2: Yeah. This is where we believe there's just an incredible opportunity to help customers make more personal finance decisions daily. Yeah. yeah This is where we believe there's just an incredible opportunity to help customers make more personal finance decisions daily. this is where we believe there's just an incredible opportunity to help customers make more personal finance decisions daily

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: Our focus right now is really how do we drive that engagement on a daily basis with our Credit Karma members? We're deploying a fleet of agents that we're calling assistants starting with like a refund assistant. You know, you get a. Our focus right now is really how do we drive that engagement on a daily basis with our Credit Karma members? our focus right now is really how do we drive that engagement on a daily basis with our credit karma members We're deploying a fleet of agents that we're calling assistants starting with like a refund assistant. we're deploying a fleet of agents that we're calling assistants starting with like a refund assistant You know, you get a. you know you get a

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: A $4,000 check through tax. What do you do with it, right? What do you do with that money? And what's the best application for it? So our refund assistant will know what kind of what's your debt portfolio, right? 57% of Credit Karma members have revolving debt. So we can help them make better financial decisions based on that moment in time. A $4,000 check through tax. a $4,000 check through tax What do you do with it, right? what do you do with it right What do you do with that money? what do you do with that money And what's the best application for it? and what's the best application for it So our refund assistant will know what kind of what's your debt portfolio, right? 57% of Credit Karma members have revolving debt. so our refund assistant will know what kind of what's your debt portfolio right 57% of credit karma members have revolving debt So we can help them make better financial decisions based on that moment in time. so we can help them make better financial decisions based on that moment in time

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: That they get that big refund, maybe pay off some of that debt, maybe rotate it into something that's more advantageous for them. How do you set up high-yield savings and really start to get them on a journey of financial health, right? We also have the debt assistant that'll be constantly working in the background for our members, and surface opportunities for them to make better debt decisions on a year-round basis. We have Credit Spark. Credit is a huge problem for Gen Z, right? That they get that big refund, maybe pay off some of that debt, maybe rotate it into something that's more advantageous for them. that they get that big refund maybe pay off some of that debt maybe rotate it into something that's more advantageous for them How do you set up high-yield savings and really start to get them on a journey of financial health, right? how do you set up high-yield savings and really start to get them on a journey of financial health right We also have the debt assistant that'll be constantly working in the background for our members, and surface opportunities for them to make better debt decisions on a year-round basis. we also have the debt assistant that'll be constantly working in the background for our members and surface opportunities for them to make better debt decisions on a year-round basis We have Credit Spark. we have credit spark Credit is a huge problem for Gen Z, right? credit is a huge problem for gen z right

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: Not a problem, but it's a. Not a problem, but it's a. not a problem but it's a

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah yeah

Speaker 2: They're new to it. So Credit Spark is an agent that we're deploying, that will look at where their spending habits are and make recommendations and for them to leverage, like, things like utilities or rent and to improving their credit score real-time. That will be very powerful for them as they start their financial journey. They're new to it. they're new to it So Credit Spark is an agent that we're deploying, that will look at where their spending habits are and make recommendations and for them to leverage, like, things like utilities or rent and to improving their credit score real-time. so credit spark is an agent that we're deploying that will look at where their spending habits are and make recommendations and for them to leverage like things like utilities or rent and to improving their credit score real-time That will be very powerful for them as they start their financial journey. that will be very powerful for them as they start their financial journey

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: That's how we think about Credit Karma. It's an incredible platform that has 43 million monthly active users, and that just gives us an incredible opportunity to engage every day in those everyday decisions that members have to make. That's how we think about Credit Karma. that's how we think about credit karma It's an incredible platform that has 43 million monthly active users, and that just gives us an incredible opportunity to engage every day in those everyday decisions that members have to make. it's an incredible platform that has 43 million monthly active users and that just gives us an incredible opportunity to engage every day in those everyday decisions that members have to make

Speaker 1: What can you do there on the product side or the offering side to kind of maybe remove some of the cyclicality? Remember we kind of started with like 25% plus growth, then we went kind of. What can you do there on the product side or the offering side to kind of maybe remove some of the cyclicality? what can you do there on the product side or the offering side to kind of maybe remove some of the cyclicality Remember we kind of started with like 25% plus growth, then we went kind of. remember we kind of started with like 25% plus growth then we went kind of

Speaker 2: Yeah. I remember. Yeah. yeah I remember. i remember

Speaker 1: And we went down. Now we're coming back up again. Like, is there anything to way to smooth it out, or is that kind of something that we kind of need to appreciate it? And we went down. and we went down Now we're coming back up again. now we're coming back up again Like, is there anything to way to smooth it out, or is that kind of something that we kind of need to appreciate it? like is there anything to way to smooth it out or is that kind of something that we kind of need to appreciate it

Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 1: This is what it is. Yeah. This is what it is. this is what it is Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: Yeah. No. It's a great question. So one, there is experience, and that's really solving more problems for customers, right, and members, right? So that's all the agent work that we're doing, that I had talked about. And that's all based on the data that we have on customers, and them, and their connected accounts. And that allows us to spread our risks. Many years ago, we were largely a credit card business. Now we've expanded verticals as well, right? We've got personal loans that's growing. Yeah. yeah No. no It's a great question. it's a great question So one, there is experience, and that's really solving more problems for customers, right, and members, right? so one there is experience and that's really solving more problems for customers right and members right So that's all the agent work that we're doing, that I had talked about. so that's all the agent work that we're doing that i had talked about And that's all based on the data that we have on customers, and them, and their connected accounts. and that's all based on the data that we have on customers and them and their connected accounts And that allows us to spread our risks. and that allows us to spread our risks Many years ago, we were largely a credit card business. many years ago we were largely a credit card business Now we've expanded verticals as well, right? now we've expanded verticals as well right We've got personal loans that's growing. we've got personal loans that's growing

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: Significantly. We've got insurance. We've got new markets and new opportunities in other areas like home, and we have Credit Karma Money that we need to invest in. That's a daily app. So there's also an expansion of the services that we can offer for customers. Significantly. significantly We've got insurance. we've got insurance We've got new markets and new opportunities in other areas like home, and we have Credit Karma Money that we need to invest in. we've got new markets and new opportunities in other areas like home and we have credit karma money that we need to invest in That's a daily app. that's a daily app So there's also an expansion of the services that we can offer for customers. so there's also an expansion of the services that we can offer for customers

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: and that will spread out risk and also enable us to, in good times, right, in good macro times or maybe bad macro times, be able to offer the financial advice that they need, and take action against. And that's really the promise that we see within the Credit Karma platform. and that will spread out risk and also enable us to, in good times, right, in good macro times or maybe bad macro times, be able to offer the financial advice that they need, and take action against. and that will spread out risk and also enable us to in good times right in good macro times or maybe bad macro times be able to offer the financial advice that they need and take action against And that's really the promise that we see within the Credit Karma platform. and that's really the promise that we see within the credit karma platform

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. And then, is there, if you think about Credit Karma connects to TurboTax, if you think about it, also go to the other side of QuickBooks, like, how is that connection? Is there like. Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah And then, is there, if you think about Credit Karma connects to TurboTax, if you think about it, also go to the other side of QuickBooks, like, how is that connection? and then is there if you think about credit karma connects to turbotax if you think about it also go to the other side of quickbooks like how is that connection Is there like. is there like

Speaker 2: Oh, quick. Oh, quick. oh quick

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: Yeah. There is a cohort of small businesses within Credit Karma that we can offer business loans to for sure. Yeah. yeah There is a cohort of small businesses within Credit Karma that we can offer business loans to for sure. there is a cohort of small businesses within credit karma that we can offer business loans to for sure

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: And that's actively worked. But what we're really excited is with our business tax offering, right? Because that job to be done taxes for a small business is very difficult and can be very impactful to the operations of their business. And so we deployed Biztax last year at scale, and we were very excited about the breakthrough that we got there. What we have an opportunity to do is that moment in time that they're filing their taxes is to start to establish a relationship with them through QuickBooks. And that's actively worked. and that's actively worked But what we're really excited is with our business tax offering, right? but what we're really excited is with our business tax offering right Because that job to be done taxes for a small business is very difficult and can be very impactful to the operations of their business. because that job to be done taxes for a small business is very difficult and can be very impactful to the operations of their business And so we deployed Biztax last year at scale, and we were very excited about the breakthrough that we got there. and so we deployed biztax last year at scale and we were very excited about the breakthrough that we got there What we have an opportunity to do is that moment in time that they're filing their taxes is to start to establish a relationship with them through QuickBooks. what we have an opportunity to do is that moment in time that they're filing their taxes is to start to establish a relationship with them through quickbooks

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: On a year-round basis, and there's a lot of opportunity because not all of our customers are already QuickBooks customers that are coming in. That allows us to then really get them into a QuickBooks product that's right for them that helps them manage their finances year-round versus coming to us with a spreadsheet and saying, "What do I do? How do I file my taxes? On a year-round basis, and there's a lot of opportunity because not all of our customers are already QuickBooks customers that are coming in. on a year-round basis and there's a lot of opportunity because not all of our customers are already quickbooks customers that are coming in That allows us to then really get them into a QuickBooks product that's right for them that helps them manage their finances year-round versus coming to us with a spreadsheet and saying, "What do I do? that allows us to then really get them into a quickbooks product that's right for them that helps them manage their finances year-round versus coming to us with a spreadsheet and saying "what do i do How do I file my taxes? how do i file my taxes

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: and so that's another flywheel, if you will, within the broader Intuit ecosystem that we're really excited about. and so that's another flywheel, if you will, within the broader Intuit ecosystem that we're really excited about. and so that's another flywheel if you will within the broader intuit ecosystem that we're really excited about

Speaker 1: Yeah. Okay. In the last few minutes I want to spend, like, as we're moving closer towards the tax season now, we're in December. Yeah. yeah Okay. okay In the last few minutes I want to spend, like, as we're moving closer towards the tax season now, we're in December. in the last few minutes i want to spend like as we're moving closer towards the tax season now we're in december

Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 1: Like, you talked a little bit about making your onboarding easier. Like, how do you think about the new tax season if you kind of plan it out? Like, is it kind of what I learned last time around, like try to change it, or like how does that process work for you? Like, you talked a little bit about making your onboarding easier. like you talked a little bit about making your onboarding easier Like, how do you think about the new tax season if you kind of plan it out? like how do you think about the new tax season if you kind of plan it out Like, is it kind of what I learned last time around, like try to change it, or like how does that process work for you? like is it kind of what i learned last time around like try to change it or like how does that process work for you

Speaker 2: Yeah. So, there was a lot that we learned through last tax season that carries forward into this year. Yeah. yeah So, there was a lot that we learned through last tax season that carries forward into this year. so there was a lot that we learned through last tax season that carries forward into this year

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: And there's a lot more new innovation that we're deploying. So we're very excited about this tax season. One, we have been deeply embedded within Credit Karma, and those monthly interactions are helping us smooth that onboarding experience and really make it much more natural to go from Credit Karma. And there's a lot more new innovation that we're deploying. and there's a lot more new innovation that we're deploying So we're very excited about this tax season. so we're very excited about this tax season One, we have been deeply embedded within Credit Karma, and those monthly interactions are helping us smooth that onboarding experience and really make it much more natural to go from Credit Karma. one we have been deeply embedded within credit karma and those monthly interactions are helping us smooth that onboarding experience and really make it much more natural to go from credit karma

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: To TurboTax. Data experiences. The other is, we're going big with our local presence, right? We're opening up 600 service centers, 20 retail stores, roughly 20, and one flagship. And what that does is it unlocks the whole category of customers that are interested in someone doing their taxes that's close to them. And when we did that last year, and we did it towards the tail end of last year, we saw a 5X engagement rate with our experts. And so we've really refined and built some incredible new innovation that's going to allow us to meet those customers in the communities that they're in, with the best expert network that's out there in the industry. To TurboTax. to turbotax Data experiences. data experiences The other is, we're going big with our local presence, right? the other is we're going big with our local presence right We're opening up 600 service centers, 20 retail stores, roughly 20, and one flagship. we're opening up 600 service centers 20 retail stores roughly 20 and one flagship And what that does is it unlocks the whole category of customers that are interested in someone doing their taxes that's close to them. and what that does is it unlocks the whole category of customers that are interested in someone doing their taxes that's close to them And when we did that last year, and we did it towards the tail end of last year, we saw a 5X engagement rate with our experts. and when we did that last year and we did it towards the tail end of last year we saw a 5x engagement rate with our experts And so we've really refined and built some incredible new innovation that's going to allow us to meet those customers in the communities that they're in, with the best expert network that's out there in the industry. and so we've really refined and built some incredible new innovation that's going to allow us to meet those customers in the communities that they're in with the best expert network that's out there in the industry

Speaker 1: Yeah. What's the, I mean, the counter argument with that is like you're rebuilding what was there before. Like, what's different about this local versus. Yeah. yeah What's the, I mean, the counter argument with that is like you're rebuilding what was there before. what's the i mean the counter argument with that is like you're rebuilding what was there before Like, what's different about this local versus. like what's different about this local versus

Speaker 2: One is our brand. One is our brand. one is our brand

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: Our brand is super powerful. Two is that we're a technology-first view, so in our platform, and so you don't have to come in with papers. You don't have to come in with anything. You just show up. Our brand is super powerful. our brand is super powerful Two is that we're a technology-first view, so in our platform, and so you don't have to come in with papers. two is that we're a technology-first view so in our platform and so you don't have to come in with papers You don't have to come in with anything. you don't have to come in with anything You just show up. you just show up

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: And then we can engage with you, and then we connect all your accounts, and that's when the magic happens. And it's much faster. And then we can engage with you, and then we connect all your accounts, and that's when the magic happens. and then we can engage with you and then we connect all your accounts and that's when the magic happens And it's much faster. and it's much faster

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: Right? So that we really focus on an experience. Our price points are very attractive for our full service. Right? right So that we really focus on an experience. so that we really focus on an experience Our price points are very attractive for our full service. our price points are very attractive for our full service

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: and then you get fast access to money, right? Again, it all comes down to the money and how fast can I get it into my account for a vast majority of Americans. and then you get fast access to money, right? and then you get fast access to money right Again, it all comes down to the money and how fast can I get it into my account for a vast majority of Americans. again it all comes down to the money and how fast can i get it into my account for a vast majority of americans

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: and that's where we're really uniquely positioned over any other service. And then now with Credit Karma, we can take that refund and make it go much further, right? And so that's the last, you know, the last. and that's where we're really uniquely positioned over any other service. and that's where we're really uniquely positioned over any other service And then now with Credit Karma, we can take that refund and make it go much further, right? and then now with credit karma we can take that refund and make it go much further right And so that's the last, you know, the last. and so that's the last you know the last

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: step, that keeps us engaged, and they come back to us yearly. step, that keeps us engaged, and they come back to us yearly. step that keeps us engaged and they come back to us yearly

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: And with it, you know, the 5X engagement was a massive breakthrough for us because it was within a 50-mile radius, right, of an expert. We're like, "Okay. That means a lot," right? And with it, you know, the 5X engagement was a massive breakthrough for us because it was within a 50-mile radius, right, of an expert. and with it you know the 5x engagement was a massive breakthrough for us because it was within a 50-mile radius right of an expert We're like, "Okay. we're like "okay That means a lot," right? that means a lot," right

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: Being local means a lot to consumers, and so we're doubling down on that. Being local means a lot to consumers, and so we're doubling down on that. being local means a lot to consumers and so we're doubling down on that

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. That's a kind of, yeah, that's after all these years, there's a new learning, yeah? Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah That's a kind of, yeah, that's after all these years, there's a new learning, yeah? that's a kind of yeah that's after all these years there's a new learning yeah

Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: That's, that's what's fun about experimenting. That's, that's what's fun about experimenting. that's that's what's fun about experimenting

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No. Okay. That's interesting. Then last question for me, so there's the growth and you kind of guide for that. There's also then the profitability envelope that you have to kind of achieve those things. Like. Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah No. no Okay. okay That's interesting. that's interesting Then last question for me, so there's the growth and you kind of guide for that. then last question for me so there's the growth and you kind of guide for that There's also then the profitability envelope that you have to kind of achieve those things. there's also then the profitability envelope that you have to kind of achieve those things Like. like

Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. mm-hmm

Speaker 1: Talk a little bit about that dynamic of growth versus margins that, you know, you have to live with. Talk a little bit about that dynamic of growth versus margins that, you know, you have to live with. talk a little bit about that dynamic of growth versus margins that you know you have to live with

Speaker 2: Yeah. We manage at a portfolio level, right? We have many different ways that customers monetize with us, and that gives us a lot of flexibility to lean in. Yeah. yeah We manage at a portfolio level, right? we manage at a portfolio level right We have many different ways that customers monetize with us, and that gives us a lot of flexibility to lean in. we have many different ways that customers monetize with us and that gives us a lot of flexibility to lean in

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: And look at it at a portfolio level. It is something that, you know, we as a team and the consumer group, and I know they do in the business team as well, look at every day and how do we make those investments and how do we model those investments that may show monetization somewhere else. And look at it at a portfolio level. and look at it at a portfolio level It is something that, you know, we as a team and the consumer group, and I know they do in the business team as well, look at every day and how do we make those investments and how do we model those investments that may show monetization somewhere else. it is something that you know we as a team and the consumer group and i know they do in the business team as well look at every day and how do we make those investments and how do we model those investments that may show monetization somewhere else

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah

Speaker 2: but we get engaged a customer is really what we need to stay focused on. but we get engaged a customer is really what we need to stay focused on. but we get engaged a customer is really what we need to stay focused on

Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Perfect. Same, that's a good closing statement, actually. Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah Yeah. yeah Okay. okay Perfect. perfect Same, that's a good closing statement, actually. same that's a good closing statement actually

Speaker 2: Okay. Okay. okay

Speaker 1: Perfect. Thank you, Mark. Perfect. perfect Thank you, Mark. thank you mark

Speaker 2: Thank you. Thank you. thank you

Speaker 1: I really enjoyed our conversation. I really enjoyed our conversation. i really enjoyed our conversation

Speaker 2: Thank you. Thank you. thank you

Speaker 1: Thank you. Thank you. thank you

Speaker 2: Thanks. Thanks. thanks

Speaker 1: Thank you. Thank you. thank you

Speaker 2: All right. Thanks. Appreciate it. All right. all right Thanks. thanks Appreciate it. appreciate it